Today is a big day because I am blogging from my new BlackBerry, oh yeah and Obama is getting inaugurated. All joking aside I have mixed emotions today about all the hype. I live about an hour + away from DC and the craziness started last week. DC was, and is, shut down to all traffic. Rightfully so, I cannot imagine the security nightmare on this day, no thanks.
Whether you like Obama or not, I don't care for the guy myself, not to fond of his policies, today is a historical day. I am very proud that we finally do have a Black President, its great! However, I can't get over the fact that people are allowing themselves to be blinded by the weight of the day. He is still a left wing radical. Once again, have we forgotten Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Tony Rezko and all of the hate speech that has been intertwined into this man's life???
Now, if you can believe this, I am praying for my new President and truly hoping the best for him and his family. I read Romans 13:1-7 and I am compelled too pray and obey all authority...read it, its good stuff.
So to the coming President (like he is going to read this) I hope only the best for you and your coming four years. I am a Christian first, an American second and a Republican last. I care for my country, I served it for four years of my life and I hope, pray, and strive to make it better. My prayer is you do a great job and that you surprise the RNC!
God Bless.
About Me
- ryan
- Richmond, Virginia, United States
- i reside in RVA (Richmond VA) and love my city. my heart is for this city that God would be preached and taught in Spirit and Truth. That love would prevail and conquer all things that hold us back.
14 comments:
you got a black berry? sell out. haha nah i am actually getting one soon as well, prob next few days. let's go to DC with bandanas on our faces and molotov cocktails in our hands.... sorry reliving the good ol' days from a few years ago........
Jealousy takes on many forms. :)
I am very proud that we finally do have a Black President
That's easy... try getting an atheist president. THAT would take a miracle :-)
Lee
God bless America!
I'll pray for Obama too.
And nice to see you here Lee!
Hi Bruce,
Nice to see you too :-)
I'm here until I get kicked out...
Lee
Kinda hard to kick you out Lee, you've become somewhat of a fixture.
Part of the furniture eh? :-)
Just don’t have as much time as I had since I’ve just started a new project at work and for some crazy reason, they given me the position of team lead????
Just wish it paid more… still glad it pays though - so many people got the push just before Christmas
Lee
Ryan: All joking aside I have mixed emotions today about all the hype.
I agree - Obama has been overhyped (by the media?).
He has to be better than the previous administration though :-)
Ryan: I read Romans 13:1-7 and I am compelled too pray and obey all authority...read it, its good stuff.
I find that sentiment rather puzzling (and more than a little scary).
Hypothetical time:
Your government, which as Romans 13 states is appointed by God commands you to torture or kill someone who is innocent.
Do you
a) follow the word of God and the compulsion of the authorities he has instituted,
or b) refuse
I really don't understand the appeal of Authoritarianism, of which this seems to be a classic example.
Havok Your government, which as Romans 13 states is appointed by God commands you to torture or kill someone who is innocent.
Do you
a) follow the word of God and the compulsion of the authorities he has instituted,
or b) refuse
Standard rely I normally hear:-
"My God would not do that" :-)
I think such questions are very good and should be addressed, for example
1) How would you know it was your God talking to you and not the devil (or more likely yourself).
2) How would you know God was not just testing you, and so how far would you take the test. (I believe there is a bible passage that offers guidance on this one - do I need to dig it out – hint: something about sacrificing your son)
Billy wrote a post a while back on this topic so not to derail the original post too much.
http://basketofpuppies-billy.blogspot.com/2008/09/
if-god-commanded-it-would-you-kill-your.html
Lee
Lee: Standard rely I normally hear:-
"My God would not do that" :-)
Lee, it's not about follow the voices in your head, it's about following the authorities (who, according to Romans 13, were instituted by God, and Christians are compelled to follow their commands otherwise they're going against God)
Example:
Germany in the 1930s-1940s. The authorities "instituted by God to carry out his will" under the leadership of Adolf Hitler, and which Christians are compelled to follow according to Romans 13, did some pretty terrible things. But the people doing them did no wrong, because it was God's will.
Is my reasoning incorrect here?
I read Romans 13:1-7 and I am compelled too pray and obey all authority...read it, its good stuff.
Eek... I just read this passage. I don't like it...
NOW I understand where Havok is coming from now.
Sorry about that…
Silly me not knowing the bible as well as I should.
"Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves."
SOOOooooo, Hitler was right? (Maybe, maybe not) BUT the German people were right to follow Hitler – the bible told them so.
If the rulers were wrong, it wasn’t the fault of the people who followed – God put the rulers there.
Yes Havok, how can you argue against that? :-)
Where is our reasoning wrong?
Lee
its interesting more and more as to why i do this to myself.........i just keep coming back more and more to you lovely atheists!! =) but i revel every moment of it.
the following was not written by me so i will not take credit for it. the reason that i am posting this is that it gives wonderful insight into this portion of scripture (and then some). have fun gentlemen!
______________
Our Relationship to the State -Romans 13:1-14-
God has established three institutions: the home -Gen 2:18-25-, government -Gen 9:1-7-, and the church -Acts 2-. Paul was writing to believers at the very heart of the Roman Empire. As yet, the great persecutions had not started, but were on the way. Christianity was still considered a Jewish sect, and the Jewish religion was approved by Rome. But the day would come when it would be very difficult, if not impossible, for a Christian to be loyal to the emperor. He could not drop incense on the altar and affirm, “Caesar is god!”
In our own day, we have people who teach riot and rebellion in the name of Christ! They would have us believe that the Christian thing to do is to disobey the law, rebel against the authorities, and permit every man to do that which is right in his own eyes. Paul refuted this position in this chapter by explaining four reasons why the Christian must be in subjection to the laws of the State.
For wrath’s sake -vs 1-4- . It is God who has established the governments of the world -Acts 17:24-28- . This does not mean that He is responsible for the sins of tyrants, but only that the authority to rule comes originally from God. It was this lesson that Nebuchadnezzar had to learn the hard way. -ref Daniel 4 and namely vs 17, 25 and 32- To resist the law is to resist the God who established government in the world, and this means inviting punishment.
Rulers must bear the sword; that is, they have the power to afflict punishment and even to take life. God established human government because man is a sinner and must have some kind of authority over him. God has given the sword to rulers, and with it the authority to punish and even to execute. Capital punishment was ordained in Gen 9:5-6 , and it has not been abolished. Even though we cannot always respect the man in office, we must respect the office, for government was ordained by God.
On more than one occasion in his ministry, Paul used the Roman law to protect his life and to extend his work. The centurions mentioned in the Book of Acts appear to be men of character and high ideals. Even though government officials are not believers, they are still the “ministers of God” because He established the authority of the State.
For conscience’s sake -vs 5-7-. We move a bit higher in our motivation now. Any citizen can obey the law because of fear of punishment, but a Christian ought to obey because of conscience. Of course, if the government interferes with conscience, then the Christian must obey God rather than men -Acts 5:29-. But when the law is right, the Christian must obey it if he is to maintain a good conscience -1 Timothy 1:5, 19; 3:9; 4:2; Acts 24:16-.
The United States Government maintains a “Conscience Fund” for people who want to pay their debts to the Government and yet remain anonymous. Some city governments have a similar fund. I read about a city that had investigated some tax frauds and announced that several citizens were going to be indicted. They did not release the names of the culprits. That week, a number of people visited the City Hall to “straighten out their taxes”—and many of them were not on the indictment list. When conscience begins to work, we cannot live with ourselves until we have made things right.
Romans 13:7 commands us to pay what we owe: taxes, revenue, respect, honor. If we do not pay our taxes, we show disrespect to the law, the officials, and the Lord. And this cannot but affect the conscience of the believer. We may not agree with all that is done with the money we pay in taxes, but we dare not violate our conscience by refusing to pay.
For love’s sake -vs 8-10-. Paul enlarged the circle of responsibility by including other people besides government officials. “Love one another” is the basic principle of the Christian life. It is the “new commandment” that Christ gave to us -John 13:34-. When we practice love, there is no need for any other laws, because love covers it all! If we love others, we will not sin against them. This explained why the Ten Commandments were not referred to often in the New Testament. In fact, the Sabbath commandment is not quoted at all in any of the epistles. As believers, we do not live under the Law; we live under grace. Our motive for obeying God and helping others is the love of Christ in our hearts.
Does “Owe no man anything” refer also to the Christian’s financial practices? Some people believe that it does, and that it is a sin to have a debt. J. Hudson Taylor, the godly missionary to China, would never incur a debt, basing his conviction on this verse. Charles Spurgeon, the great Baptist preacher, had the same conviction. However, the Bible does not forbid borrowing or legal financial transactions that involve interest. What the Bible does forbid is the charging of high interest, robbing the brethren, and failing to pay honest debts -ref Ex 22:25-27, Neh 5:1-11-. Matt. 25:27 and Luke 19:23 indicate that banking and investing for gain are not wrong. Certainly no one should get into unnecessary debt, or sign contracts he cannot maintain. “Thou shalt not steal.” But to make Romans 13:8 apply to all kinds of legal obligations involving money is, to me, stretching a point.
In this section, Paul has centered on the very heart of the problem—the human heart. Because the heart of man is sinful, God established government. But laws cannot change the heart; man’s heart is still selfish and can be changed only by the grace of God.
For Jesus’ sake -vs 11-14- We have come a long way in our reasons for obeying the law: from fear to conscience to love to our devotion to Jesus Christ! The emphasis is on the imminent return of Christ. As His servants, we want to be found faithful when He returns. The completion of our salvation is near! The light is dawning! Therefore, be ready!
Paul gave several admonitions in the light of the Lord’s soon return. The first is, “Wake up!” Relate this with 1 Thessalonians 5:1-11 and also Matt. 25:1-13. The second is, “Clean up!” We do not want to be found dressed in dirty garments when the Lord returns - 1 John 2:28-3:3-. The Christian wears the armor of light, not the deeds of darkness. He has no reason to get involved in the sinful pleasures of the world. Finally, Paul admonished, “Grow up!” -Romans 13:14- To “put on” the Lord Jesus Christ means to become more like Him, to receive by faith all that He is for our daily living. We grow on the basis of the food we eat. This is why God warns us not to make provisions for the flesh. If we feed the flesh, we will fail; but if we feed the inner man the nourishing things of the Spirit, we will succeed.
In other words, a Christian citizen ought to be the best citizen. Christians may not always agree on politics or parties, but they can all agree on their attitude toward human government.
its interesting more and more as to why i do this to myself.........i just keep coming back more and more to you lovely atheists!! =) but i revel every moment of it.
You love it really :-)
I will have to come back to your comment though - time is short, have to go out to a family BBQ
Lee
Ryan, it's a nice sentiment. I don't see it quite supported by the Romans 13.
Romans 13:1-2 "Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. Therefore whoever resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves."
It seems simple, Resist authority = receive condemnation.
This makes sense given Paul's apparent belief in an immanent apocalypse, but not as a continuing "rule to live by", as far as I can see.
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